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Thread: My Modified '82

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    Moderator KANE's Avatar
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    Default My Modified '82

    ENGINE MANAGEMENT: Dynamic EFI EBL with TT-1 WB O2 sensor
    ENGINE INTERNALS: Erson, .465″ in / .488″ ex, 224/234, 110 LSA
    FUEL DELIVERY: Balanced TB units with 80lb injectors, VAFPR set to 15psi on idle / 20psi off idle, and a DCS Renegade Intake


    Modified 1982 Corvette with EBL and .465" in/.488" ex cam | VetteTube
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
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    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    Administrator Yoda's Avatar
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    Looks like RARE but it sure don't sound like RARE

    Looks as good as it sounds Nice very NICE!!!

    Bud
    "Quality, not quantity"
    "The American people will never knowingly adopt "SOCIALISM." But, under the name of "LIBERALISM," they will adopt every fragment of the "SOCIALIST" program, until one day America will be a "SOCIALIST NATION," without knowing how it happened.
    (Norman Thomas, U.S. SOCIALIST PARTY CANDIDATE PARTY presidential candidate 1940, 1944 and 1948)

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    Very nice looking and sounding.

    It ought to go right quick also.
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    Hello Kane
    I have a 1982 collectors edition and I bought a Dynamic EFI from Phoenixville, Pa about 3 years ago and I haven't installed it.

    I plan to do it this summer. I am only replacing the EFI nothing else. Can you tell me if this unit will show better performance.

    and if that is all I have to change to notice any difference?

    Anything else to offer?

    Thank You, jimbil208

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    Jimbil208- if you tune it... and you have a stock motor... yes, it will run better I believe.

    However, I found having a wideband O2 sensor to be critical since there isn't a crossfire BIN that is readily available. Honestly, without it, I was struggling to get the tune down. It helps out a lot with WOT tuning- and it is very responsive for tuning everywhere else.

    Where EBL shines - in my opinion - is with cams, heads, injectors, and fuel pressures not calibrated together by GM. EBL is not something you'll figure out overnight and end up with a killer tune after two hours. I spent a lot of time searching through threads on Third Gen.org and other sites. But it is well worth it- just don't give up.

    Most of the struggle I had was the steep learning curve for tuning.

    There are guys who are a lot better than me at this stuff- but anything I can help with I'm willing to offer. Example- I have an 85 Vette spark table in MS Excel. Should work for your crossfire since the 85 heads are the same as our 82s. Send me a PM and I will send it to you.

    Aside from the spark table, I think the GM truck BIN would be a good start if you engine is stock.
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
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    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    Tuning is now done!

    Below is a summary of the outcome using post/pre data log comparisons and OEM performance numbers obtained from the CAC.



    A Few Notes on Pre/post: All data logging was measured and recorded pre/post with Dynamic EFI's "What's Up Display" software. Multiple data logging session took place in May of 2014 with 14.5psi fuel pressure, Compu-Cam .425”/ .440” cam, 65lb injectors, and a Renegade intake... and then again in January of 2015 with 15/20psi, .465” / .488” cam, Renegade intake, and 80lb injectors. Unfortunately, I do not have "bone-stock" datalogs as I did not install EBL Flash until after the Renegade intake and cam were already in the car.


    Here is the complete summary…
    Air & Fuel:
    • Balanced OEM Twin Factory TBI units with anti-tamper plugs and welds removed
    • Factory air box in place with fresh air door removed
    • 31gph 1985 Corvette Fuel Pump in place of OEM pump
    • GM Marine pressure regulator modified into VAFPR (15psi idle / 20psi off idle)
    • 80lb injectors
    • Dynamic Crossfire Solutions Renegade Intake


    Engine Management:

    • Dynamic EFI EBL Flash ECM
    • TT-1 Wideband O2 sensor
    • OEM harness re-pinned for late model connectors
    • IAT sensor added to EFI harness


    Major Engine / Driveline Components:

    • .465" IN /.488" EX Erson cam
    • Cast iron heads
    • Factory 2.87 rear end gear
    • 700R4 transmission
    • Factory allow wheels 15x8 and 255/60/15 tires
    • Factory suspension
    • Factory exhaust with high flow converter
    • B&M shift re-programming kit with OEM weights and purple and orange springs


    Manufacturer's Crate Motor Dyno vs Stock Motor Comparison
    :

    • 325hp @ 5,300rpm versus stock 200hp @ 4,200rpm- to put that into perspective… at 4,200rpm it is already pushing 260hp and still has another 63hp and 1,200 rpm to go before it leaves first gear
    • 373lbs-ft of torque @ 3,600rpm versus the stock 285hp @ 2,800rpm- to put that into perspective… at 2,800rpm it is already pushing 350lbs-ft of torque and still has 800 more rpm and has another 23lbs-ft of torque left to go


    Acceleration Post/Pre:

    • Makes a 5,400-5,475rpm 1-2 shift on a warm transmission to make full use of the horsepower curve- prior to resetting the governor, 5k rpm 1-2 was the norm on a warm transmission
    • Leaves 1st gear at 47mph- 4mph faster than with just a Compu-Cam and Renegade intake
    • Takes up 2nd gear at 56mph @ 3,500rpm- 8mph faster than with the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake @ 3,000rpm
    • Leaves 2nd gear at 80mph @ 5k rpm- 5mph faster than with the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake
    • Takes up 3rd gear @ 81mph @ 3,200rpm- versus 3,000rpm with the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake
    • Buries the speedometer needle within the first second of third gear- at the 9 second mark of a rolling start. That’s a full two seconds faster than the Compu-Cam and the Renegade intake
    • Rolling start (~5mph) to 60mph is 5.3 seconds. The best time with just the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake was 6.6 seconds. It is now a full second and 1/3 faster than tuning on the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake alone- and almost two and a seconds faster than stock 0-60mph
    • Rolling start (~5mph) to 80mph is 8.3 seconds. The best time with just the Compu-Cam and Renegade intake was 10.5 seconds. That’s a full two and 1/5 seconds faster than the Compu-Cam cam and the Renegade intake alone- and almost six seconds faster than stock 0-80mph
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    Attached is a datalog of the pre/post... this is the closest thing to a dyno of results.

    For reference, the "post" results are superimposed upon the "pre" results.

    The .465 cam accelerates a lot faster than the .425 cam- and with the 400 or so rpm increase on WOT, the dividends are huge at the point in which the car shifts from first gear and into second.





    Also a point to note... the "post" test was run in open loop. So while the PE values were about dead on, there was still some adjustment needed in the lower KPAs off wide open throttle. Also, the Compu-Cam was running closer to high 12s and low 13s for AFR at WOT while the Erson cam likes to run in the lower 12s.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails prepost-jpg  
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    I wanted to create a sleeper...


    So it was very important to keep the car looking as close to factory as possible. I have tried to retain as much of the OE pieces and parts under the hood as I could.

    The most obvious change is the removal of the fresh air door to assist with breathing. Otherwise, everything looks to be in order. The AIR system is capped off in the photo below so that I can get the most accurate readings I could get with the wideband O2 sensor while I was tuning.




    VAFPR:
    The hose routes through the thermo switch on the air box.


    Close up of the VAFPR mod...


    IAT:
    I added the IAT to the underside of the air box on the snorkel so that I could clear the fuel line that runs between the TBs.



    Balanced TBIs:
    Spare wood, a printed out ruler, and $3 in hose and we have a tool!


    Renegade Intake:
    Yes... this intake launched a thousand flame posts across many a message board, but it really does fit under the hood quite well. And it works with a bigger cam and tuning.
    This is an older photo that dates back to summer 2013- but thought I'd post it since it is part of the list of mods.
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
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    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

  9. #9
    My Modified '82 82ColEd's Avatar
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    Thanks for putting this all together, i see it as a great reference, if one decides to go that route..

    Stefan
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    ThirdGen.Org and GearHeads are two forums where there are a lot of people who do significant tuning.

    I am still very, very much a novice at this. But I do want to share what I've done as well as things I have learned along the way. What I will say is that EBL is great for many reasons, but the biggest reason is the nearly complete flexibility in tuning that I have with resepct to sclars, tables, and word options. Also, I don't think I could have afforded the amount of time I spent tuning if I paid someone else to do it.




    A few observations, thoughts, things I learned, and things I that worked for me...


    • Components:
      • One of the biggest headaches was a bad harness connector for the wideband O2 sensor on the controller side. That gave me absolute fits!! The contacts weren't crimped down enough or something and it caused the sensor to never come out of warm up mode. I thought my 32 year old exhaust system was leaking and could never get more than a 14.5-14.7 reading. Consequently, I had a terrible time trying to tune PE mode. Using the NB sensor worked fine for tuning everything but PE, but it doesn't work for PE. How did I find it? I spoke with Dynamic EFI and shared some logs. They suggested to send back the unit and have them check. As I was pulling the connector back through, it came off and the leads were still twisted nicely for the crimp. Dynamic EFI took care of it- they are great to work with and have the best service of any small business I have ever seen. My observation is you will drive yourself crazy tuning if your wideband isn't operating properly.
      • I had a TPS sensor that malfunctioned and a couple of IACs that worked somewhat. They worked- kinda- but not perfectly and not all the time. My thoughts here are that I should have looked at them like they were wear items when I started and simply replaced them ahead of tuning. I spent less than $150 on those three parts and while replacing them took only minutes, it took hours to figure out they weren't running properly because the problems were subtle. Such as an intermittent flat spot on the TPS readings or the intermittent sticking of an IAC.



    • Routing & re-pinning the harness: This was fairly easy, although many folks cringe at this. What I found helpful was to create a color by color crosswalk for moving the CFI leads into the late-model GM connectors. I used wiring schematics (1982 Corvette) and then a TBI pin-out schematic and tested about a quarter of the wires just to make sure what the schematics showed to be the sensor was in fact correct. I also found that I could run the IAT lead that I added along side the OEM harness as it made its way from the rear of the car to the bulkhead and up to the air box. I also ran it through the OEM conduit loom. Advance Auto sells replacement pigtails for less than $20, so this was an easy "no waiting for UPS" kinda project. I also ran the TT-1 wideband power leads along side the OEM harness and even grounded it under the hood to the same grounds the CFI harness used on the block.



    • Notes on Tuning:
      • 112 LSA Cam, low RPMs, AFR, and open loop/closed loop idle: I am running a cam with a little less overlap. I also can run a richer AFR without fear of destroying the catalyst with my exhaust configuration. Consequently, I can run a little richer AFR and can tune around the LSA. It is my understanding that at lower RPMs the LSA makes a bigger difference and can make tuning somewhat a challenge. So I adjusted the commander AFR and can run the engine at idle in closed loop- and yes, it runs quite well with no codes or a rough idle. It also helps that my idle speed is about 750rpm (rolls between 700-800rpm) and I have adjusted the minimum idle and balanced the TB units for a minimum idle of 600rpm. My AFR at WOT is between 12 and 12.3 to 1 and that is waht the cam and intake seem to work the best with in my testing and tuning.
      • VAFPR: I didn't want to use an Aeromotive piece because I wanted the car to look as close to stock as possible. The housing for my FPR is actually from a GM marine application where there is a discharge tube that would allow for any leaks to drain into the intake. The housing is sealed and by applying vacuum to the unit, it can now be used as a VAFPR. By lobbing off a portion of the tube and removing a locating ear that is not needed by the CFI TB unit, I was able to rotate the housing 90 degrees and then use it as a VAPR. With this set up, I have 15psi at idle and then off idle it jumps to 20psi... which is perfect for what I need it for. Best of all, it is hidden inside the OEM airbox and completely unnoticeable!
      • IAT: I needed to add an IAT sensor for the EBL system. I also needed a place to mount it and I wanted it to be out of sight. By locating it in the snorkel on the underside of the airbox, it too is out of sight.
      • Idle speed: I started with a GM truck BIN, and the trucks run a fairly low idle speed. So I adjusted all of the tables dealing with idle to make sure it idled where I wanted it, which meant that I needed to adjust the idle speed at different temps to bring it up higher than what the original bin called for.
      • SA Tables: I was able to find the SA table for an 86 iron headed Vette under a different XDF file... and then copied & pasted it into MS Excell... which was a perfect starting point for my tables. The '86 Vette with iron heads uses the same heads as the 82 & 84 Vettes. I also pulled the spark up on the PE adder tables to get it to 36 degrees (per my engine builder) at WOT. I added a little more spark earlier than what the 86 SA table called for and that helped a lot too. Most importantly... I am not getting any knock with the tables I am using.
      • Lean Cruise & Async Mode: I went ahead and disabled lean cruise as well as Async injector mode. I don't feel that I need lean cruise and disabling keeps it from the slight bucking at 1200rpm in overdrive while cruising as it would go into or out of lean cruise. The transition mode to Async mode wasn't as smooth as I wanted where the ECM was struggling a little bit to keep up with the change, but since I don't need the extra fuel as part of a fueling strategy that Async would allow for... it works fine without it. From what I have read, getting a good transition from sync to Async is pretty difficult. Disabling async would likely really benefit a dual plane, but on my intake it's only a small improvement because both injectors serve a common plenum. My point here is that it helps with my intake and fueling needs, but don't expect a big difference.
      • BPC & VE: This is an area that I had to adjust as I had plenty of duty cycle (less than 85%) but ran out of VE (100%). I set the BPC for my fuel pressure and then had to increase the BPC table while lowering the VE tables. RBob talked me through how to do this- and it worked quite well. Ideally, I would have gotten readings for BPC at the different KPAs, but this technique has worked for me. Now, my overall VE doesn't get past 87% at WOT on the high speed tables (at 4,400rpm) and my injector duty cycle is still only 80% at 5,450rpm at WOT.
      • Overall adjustments: I think when all was said and done I have made changes to 30 some odd tables, sclars, and word options. I can also tell you that I have not been able to find a BIN ("chip" programming) or XDF (definition file for a given system) for the original crossfire. So these changes are relative to what you'd see when using either a truck BIN or 5.0 Fbody BIN. Some tweakss were harder to identify (such as deciding what temp to set closed loop based upon engine performance or setting the shift point on the tranny) while others were easier (identifying a need for a better SA table was very easy). I also can't reiterate how beneficial resetting the 1-2 shift point has been- the OE shift point was just too low for this motor. Every car is different, but getting the 1-2 to happen just after peak HP has made a world of a difference in the way the car feels.



    But it has been well worth it! Hope this helps someone who is on the fence about what can be done with their car.
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    Thank you very much for the information. I will put it to use this summer.

    Right now I am trying to organize everything

    jimbil208

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    Well... I think I have the tune pretty much nailed down. Over the fall and winter, I spent some time nailing a bunch of little things down. Such as tweaking some of the CTS tables and multipliers for when it is cold / hot, adjusting different settings, finally had a dedicated bung welded in for the WB, etc. I also added in some spark in a couple places- such as the lower MAP areas between 1k and 2k rpm. I also added some spark to a couple of areas between 60 and 80 KPAs too. That has seemed to help a few things around transition between moderate cruise and moving into WOT.

    Oh... and I recently added larger bore TBs.

    I am at 49mm- so I am 3mm over stock and 3mm shy of the 2" TBs that many folks have used with cams that are larger than mine. Thought I'd split the difference as I can always go larger... but not smaller... once the boring starts. I don't want to lose velocity and hurt my low end since I have a 2.87 rear end, so the 49mm should flow high 600s in the CFM department. That should compliment my cam nicely.

    I've been looking through logs at my MAP readings and thinking about how I may be running out of breath a little between 5-5.5k rpm. I was dropping to about 92/93 KPAs between 5-5.5k and now I'm at 93/94 in that same area. I still have a bit of a restriction with the OEM airbox and so I am going to hack up a spare air cleaner base and try to get a little more air from the bottom of the assembly.

    Adding 3mm more has helped along with getting the TBs machined for bushings on the throttle shafts. The off idle to 2k rpm area benefited greatly from getting the TBs done. When I crack the throttle... it lunges- and the nose jumps up.



    As an aside... MAXBORE will bore your CFI TBs. When I decided to get the TBs bored, I had a lot of difficulty finding someone to do this as many of the folks who used to have simply stopped. Maxbore will bore anything - from TPI to CFI as well as LSx and imports.

    Attached are a couple of photos. The first shows the difference between an OE TB and my bored TB. The other is of both of the bored TBs.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails img_0521-jpg   img_0529-jpg  
    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
    Likes geekinavette liked this post
    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

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    Default 82 Crossfire

    I love what Kane has done. In fact, I will attempt to follow closely behind. With one minor exception - heads.

    My 82 is a dog. And my dream of building a Factory Five Cobra has disappeared - Reality is, a Cobra is beyond my budget.

    So, updating my '82 has started. With
    The Renegade
    The EBL engine management computer
    An '85 fuel pump
    Heads - Probably Skip Whites ProMaxx 200 cc.

    Maybe I will put in a 427 SBC stroker. But that's for later.

    My goal with the "somewhat" stock motor is 300HP - with a stroker it bumps up to 400...
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    Moderator KANE's Avatar
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    My focus the last few months has been around the improvement.

    Fuel pressure is good... spark tables are good... VE was good. All the major stuff is good.

    No, now it's down to the small things.


    Ah.... but the small stuff is important too- because enough of them added together makes a big difference.

    IAT/CTS Blend Filter
    I have the IAT mounted on front of the radiator in the air stream just ahead of the fresh air chamber entrance. This has taken me a while and a lot of notes to understand the % split needs... but it seems to be a lot more consistent in terms of measuring the air as it adds very little (or takes away very little) on cruise once it is warmed up. Basically, at idle it is pointing more to the CTS and then points almost 90% to the IAT once it is at WOT.
    GmSec %OfCTS
    0 39.61
    16 31.76
    32 28.63
    48 26.67
    64 25.1
    80 23.92
    96 22.75
    112 21.18
    128 20
    144 19.22
    160 17.65
    176 16.47
    192 14.9
    208 12.94
    224 10.98
    240 8.63
    255 5.1

    O2 window for closed loop
    Idle in closed loop runs 13:8 when on the rich side and then right about 15:1 when lean- but hovers mostly with a roll between 14:1 and 14.7:1 since it is an automatic and will benefit from a slightly richer mixture since it has load in drive. So, I am running the following settings for idle:
    Mean R/L: 620.62 mV
    Rich: 651.00 mV
    Lean: 607.60 mV

    INT Mean, Rich, and Lean
    Meanwhile, when in cruise or decel I am running the following settings across all MAP values:
    INT Mean: 642 mV
    INT Rich: 672 mV
    INT Lean: 616 mV

    IAC - TF Gain, Delay Filters, and Decay Delay
    I've massaged these a lot to get a really crisp off-idle throttle response. The throttle is very responsive now.

    AE
    I've found that I don't really need a whole lot of AE. My AFR stays where it should and then it runs quite well, with a burst of momentary fuel that brings it to to a lower AFR when the pedal is hit.

    dTPS uSEC
    0 244.14
    3 549.32
    6 1037.6
    9 1892.09
    13 2563.48
    16 2868.65
    19 3051.76
    22 3295.9
    25 3540.04
    28 3845.21
    31 4089.36
    35 4272.46
    38 4394.53
    41 4455.57
    44 4577.64
    47 4760.74
    50 5004.88


    dMAP uSEC
    0 61.04
    10 122.07
    20 305.18
    30 549.32
    40 671.39
    50 793.46
    60 854.49
    70 915.53
    80 1037.6


    Closed Loop: Cruise and Idle
    Yes- I have the tune squared away enough that I can run in both modes in closed loop. This took a lot of tweaking with the INT O2 settings, the throttle follower settings, and AE... but wow- it's running great with only a drone during cruise and then no bucking at low rpms in gear!


    I really love how it is running!


    1982 Dark Blue Corvette
    Crossfire Injection | .496"/.495" Cam | AFR Eliminator Heads | EBL | 3.73
    0-60mph in four and a half seconds



    1995 Trans Am
    1 of 1 Trans Am | 100% documented | RPOs 48U, MN6, and GU6
    1982 Chevrolet Corvette , 350 2k RPM Stall Converter + Updgraded Transmission + Governor Set For 5,450rpm Shifts 3.73 Code 42 Dark Mettalic Blue with a twist

  15. #15
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    Mar 2014
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    Columbus, NC/NE Georgia
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    1997 boosted silver coupe
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    Quote Originally Posted by KANE View Post
    I wanted to create a sleeper...
    Kane,
    A sleeper was my thought also. After a very naughty life with cars; my thought what folks listen for the sound of headers, cam and the whine of a diff. So how about a stock sounding C5?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoNv...l8mQnkMxbpiwJD

    She said I hear the blower and broke my heart.

    I know it sounds about as stock as yours does. At the end of the day; the reality is there isn't any such thing as a sleeper.

    That being said, my compliments to a beautiful example of a sweet sounding Corvette.

    Whoosh, and blur
    Likes KANE liked this post

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