• DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression
  • DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression
  • DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression
  • DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression

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  1. #1
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression 6 Shooter's Avatar
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    Default DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression

    NASCAR investigating safety features after seven injured
    By David Caraviello, NASCAR.COM
    April 27, 2009
    06:32 PM EDT


    NASCAR may implement harsher penalties for blocking and aggressive driving in the wake of Sunday's final-lap accident at Talladega Superspeedway, but stopped short of blaming the drivers for the crash that sent Carl Edwards flying into the track's restraining fence.

    Seven fans in the grandstand were injured by flying debris when Edwards' car went airborne following contact with the vehicle of eventual race winner Brad Keselowski. Edwards walked away uninjured. The accident occurred as Keselowski was trying to pass while remaining above the yellow line at the bottom of the race track -- dipping below it would have resulted in a penalty -- and Edwards attempted to protect his position by blocking.

    "We tried letting the competitors police themselves when it comes to blocking and bump drafting," Jim Hunter, NASCAR's vice president for corporate communications, said on a conference call with reporters Monday. "We might have to start making some judgment calls of our own and issue penalties for drivers who blatantly block and abuse the bump drafting. We're going to take whatever measures we need to in order to ensure the races are as safe as possible for everyone."

    Yet NASCAR steered clear of specifically blaming Keselowski and Edwards for the accident and the injuries to those in the grandstand. "I don't recall trying to blame anything on anyone," Hunter said.

    NASCAR has taken a more stringent stance on aggressive driving on restrictor-plate venues in recent years, going as far as to install "no zones" around Talladega and Daytona where excessive bump-drafting and other aggressive moves are off limits. Robin Pemberton, NASCAR's vice president for competition, said that any further restrictions that result from Sunday's incident will likely be procedural, meaning that drivers will serve penalties during a race rather than have points docked or fines levied afterward.

    "A greater emphasis may come at Daytona and Talladega, because we have tried to let the racers take care of themselves," Pemberton said. "When certain situations develop a pattern on a more regular basis, that's where we may have to step in and make some calls. We really don't want them to put us in that position to make those calls. We'd rather let the competitors take care of it on the track."

    Despite the injuries to fans, Hunter said the safety systems in place Sunday worked properly. Pemberton said the roof flaps on Edwards' car did deploy, and that the vehicle was in the process of settling to the ground before it was struck by the oncoming car of Ryan Newman, which sent it airborne. Hunter added that the restraining fence did its job, even though some pieces of debris went through it.

    "Nothing is bulletproof," Hunter said. "From what we saw [Sunday], the restraining fence did what it was supposed to do, it threw the car back on the race track. There was some debris that went into the grandstand that fortunately did not evoke serious injury. We'll analyze the fence and make sure it did what it was suppose to do. We think it did. If there's something we come up with as we analyze his accident, we'll put it in play. We'll make it as safe as we humanly can."

    Pemberton said investigators from NASCAR were at the Roush Fenway Racing shop on Monday analyzing Edwards' car, and that the driver safety devices within all "worked accordingly." The height of the restraining fence at Talladega, he said, will also be examined. Yet any idea of reducing Talladega's 33-degree corner banking to perhaps eliminate restrictor plates or cut down on the pack racing that produces so many accidents there is likely a non-starter.

    "Flattening the track, sure, that would put us in a position where you could run without restrictor plates, but I don't see that as a real viable option," said Cup Series director John Darby.

    "I think the safety efforts that have been made today to the cars and the race tracks and everything else that surrounds Daytona and Talladega have proven effective, and they will continue to be improved as we go forward and learn more. I also believe, and it goes without mention, that the most exciting races we have today are both at Daytona and Talladega. That's a big part of our sport. Those two tracks have been a big part of our sport for many, many years. I think there's more value in continuing our safety efforts at those tracks than turning those two very historical very, exciting race tracks into flat parking lots. I don't understand that thought process."

    NASCAR.COM Article

  2. #2
    Member jrose7004's Avatar
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    I've worked many different positions at race tracks since the 70's and racers will never police themselves!

  3. #3
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression 6 Shooter's Avatar
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    Default If ya ain't Rubbing ya ain't Racing...

    If NASCAR keeps going this way it won't be long till the drivers will have to ask permission prior to passing!

    Later . . . . . .
    6 Shooter

  4. #4
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression rascal_rascal_99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrose7004 View Post
    I've worked many different positions at race tracks since the 70's and racers will never police themselves!
    I totally agree with you, nascar drivers are never going to police themselves, if anything really, nascar has made it even harder for them to do this themselves too. You get bumped out of the racing line, make it back to who dumped you and return the favor, now you're being docked laps for retaliation when the first guy plays innocent and says him getting into you was accidental and just a racing deal. Unless he does something again during that race blatantly worst that'll happen to him is being called to the nascar hauler and told to behave...yeah, right, he'll behave for the rest of the week. Because of this basic type of scenario though it's so much harder for any kind of natural policing to happen because there is so low of a level of "what are the consequences going to be if I punt this guy out of the way".

    As for blocking, I'm sure you realize how extremely difficult it will be for nascar to fairly police blocking at talledega and daytona. First off, everyone does it...everyone. This is also so much different due to the restrictor plates from F1 or the IRL not just from having fenders and bumpers but also because of how you end up with a solid pack of cars. I know I'd hate to be an official trying to explain so someone running mid pack that's been being blocked all day long why when they finally managed to get around it, now they're being penalized for it. Other tracks, sure, you could have a chance at officiating it but I don't hardly see how during a restrictor plate race. Trying to block is what wrecked Kyle Bush and Carl both, those were obvious, but how can you penalize just the leader or the blocking that happens in the front few cars and not everywhere else.

    Other than tossing out the restrictor plates I have yet to hear a valid idea at all of how to change the racing dynamics of these two tracks and without having a specific motor for these tracks, god only knows what speeds we'd see and how much worse a wreck at those speeds would end up being. Go to a smaller motor and you might still have the same problem of everyone running wide open in a pack just the same as we have now anyways.

    Even though I do blame nascar for turning these two track into the style of racing they are now, I do feel sorry for them trying to figure out the answer of how to fix it. I know I sure wouldn't want to be the guy expected to give them the solution...but until they do find a way to fix it, if they even do, we'll just keep sitting back watching racing as it is and waiting for "the big one".

  5. #5
    Member jrose7004's Avatar
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    As much as I enjoy the big tracks, Daytona & Talladega do you suppose that these kind of tracks have outlived their useful life? I mean look at the lead changes and racing you can get at the cookie cutter 1.5 mile tracks! I don't want to see either driver or fan killed because of a wreck like we saw yesterday. I'd just like to hear some discussion.

  6. #6
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression rascal_rascal_99's Avatar
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    I actually had something of the same thought about those tracks. Car technology has passed the point of what those two tracks can handle...so then came restrictor plates and we have what we have now. Flatten out talladega and you come close to having another pocono speedway which to me is one of the most boring tracks that exists. The cookie cutter D shaped mile and a half tracks are fun to watch, but they all start looking the same...I'm still holding out hope that nashville superspeedway will eventually get a cup race and give us something a little different from most of those since it's just a wee bit smaller plus it's the only one thats been built with a totally concrete racing surface. The other problem to flattening superspeedways (or any track really) is that you lose the outside racing grooves and make it a one lane track...again, boring.

    Put a chicane in the middle of the straightaways maybe, that'd start to get cars strung out a little?

  7. #7
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression ROCKETBLOCK's Avatar
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    Why doesn't NASCAR post speed limits at these tracks at the dangerous areas and police them with motorcycle cops!

    Come on, it's racing, it's enherently dangerous to a degree, and it's good that way! It isn't the World Wide Federation of Wacing.......yet. Even though NASCAR is trying to turn it into that.


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  8. #8
    Member LLC5's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jrose7004 View Post
    As much as I enjoy the big tracks, Daytona & Talladega do you suppose that these kind of tracks have outlived their useful life? I mean look at the lead changes and racing you can get at the cookie cutter 1.5 mile tracks! I don't want to see either driver or fan killed because of a wreck like we saw yesterday. I'd just like to hear some discussion.

    I doubt you will get rid of those tracks because of the revenue generated, but imposing and enforcing a no blocking rule, and no take out rule, would be nice, but you would have to enforce it. I am sick of seeing drivers being taken out from behind. Just like Keselowski held his line because of the "don't go below the line rule", Edwards would not have blocked if there was an enforced "no blocking rule". Edwards admits it was his fault for trying to block. He (Edwards) actually got what he deserved, but the other drivers and fans certaintly didn't. Just my opinion.
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  9. #9
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression rascal_rascal_99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LLC5 View Post
    I doubt you will get rid of those tracks because of the revenue generated, but imposing and enforcing a no blocking rule, and no take out rule, would be nice, but you would have to enforce it. I am sick of seeing drivers being taken out from behind. Just like Keselowski held his line because of the "don't go below the line rule", Edwards would not have blocked if there was an enforced "no blocking rule". Edwards admits it was his fault for trying to block. He (Edwards) actually got what he deserved, but the other drivers and fans certaintly didn't. Just my opinion.

    I'm not disagreeing with you, but how would you ever manage to fairly police blocking and bumping at either of these two tracks? The little of it we see at the front is one thing, but that's going on all through a 40 car pack all race long and that's where it would be almost impossible. Edwards did admit that he was to blame for it that Brad did what he had to. I was curious to hear if Kyle Bush would say the same thing about wrecking trying to block too but I never heard any post race interview with him.

    If it sounded like I was meaning I think we should get rid of these two tracks too, I probably just didn't pick my words right...and I also don't see nascar eliminating them with their history and the revenue they bring in. I do believe that with tracks their size, with that much banking and as far as cars have advanced now, that even though a certain amount of risk has to be accepted, that these tracks to me are beyond what that point of accepted risk should be. I think there are a couple of other tracks out there pushing that limit also, Atlanta for example being one of them.

    It's also easy for us to sit here and chat about what we believe the problem is, much easier than finding and implementing a solution. I kinda liked my chicane idea stuck in the middle of the back stretch! I can just imagine new decible levels of whining and crying from the drivers about how horrible the tires are...but if you went to a harder compound tire that had less grip where they couldn't just stand on the gas all the way around the track it might change things. I also wonder if they went the wrong direction with car bodies and should have tried to make them even more aerodynamic and try to create them where drafting wouldn't be nearly as important.

    I think Rocketblock is onto the right direction of things with the nascar world wide federation of wacing...and to help win over new fans and show them that nascar believes in being earth friendly, the next car of tomorrow to be introduced will have them drive Smart Cars. It would definitely solve the high speed on the track problem...I'm not even sure those things are capable of speeding on pit road either!

  10. #10
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression vett boy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ROCKETBLOCK View Post
    Why doesn't NASCAR post speed limits at these tracks at the dangerous areas and police them with motorcycle cops!

    Come on, it's racing, it's enherently dangerous to a degree, and it's good that way! It isn't the World Wide Federation of Wacing.......yet. Even though NASCAR is trying to turn it into that.

    One old geezer to another ,your right.

  11. #11
    DEGA Crash may prompt harsher penalties for aggression 6 Shooter's Avatar
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    Default If ya ain't Rubbing ya ain't Racing...

    Quote Originally Posted by 6 Shooter View Post
    If NASCAR keeps going this way it won't be long till the drivers will have to ask permission prior to passing!

    Quote Originally Posted by RocketVette View Post
    Why doesn't NASCAR post speed limits at these tracks at the dangerous areas and police them with motorcycle cops!

    Come on, it's racing, it's inherently dangerous to a degree, and it's good that way! It isn't the World Wide Federation of Wacing.......yet. Even though NASCAR is trying to turn it into that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Really-Old SilverVette Boy View Post
    One old geezer to another, your right.
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  12. #12
    Member jrose7004's Avatar
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    Beatin and bangin is what the crowd pays to see!

  13. #13
    Member Victory Red C6's Avatar
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    People go to these races to see the speed and the yes the big crashes. There is risk in everything that we do and where ever we go. People go to sleep every night. Guess what some don't get up in the morning. Yes they died in their sleep. So, I guess we shouldn't go to sleep? Hmmm.... I know that I am being silly with that line of reasoning, but again there is risk in everything that is out there. There have been people injuried and killed at hockey and baseball games from flying pucks and baseballs, and there most likely have been people killed and injuried going to and from. Where do we draw the line. Prior to this last race at Talladega when was the last time that a spectator got injuried?

    I guess NASCAR could change the cars. There have to be a few Geo/Chevy Metros, Dodge K cars, and Ford Festias out there. Yea, would that be a fun race to watch.
    The shortest distance between two points is under construction. ~ Noelie Altito.

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