Installation of a replacement exhaust

Dave123 · 06-08-05, 02:30 PM

Two of the performance upgrades I want for my vehicle is a cold air intake and exhaust upgrade.

I believe I will use a K&N cold air intake system for my vehicle as I like the look and I will not have to modify any stock components for the installation.

The exhaust I have been waiting for a good covette show in the Detroit area so I can hear some of the choices 1st hand.

Right now I am leaning towards a Borla Stinger system as it eliminates the mufflers but am concerned if the vehicle will be too loud and have the right sound I am looking for....

Maybe someone can let me know your thoughts on what sounds best...

Last I would like to install this myself. Can the stock exhaust be taken off and a new exhaust be put on without a lift just using a standard car jack. I can imagine you have to manuever the new and old exhaust out which may require the vehicle to be raised higher than what a normat jack will provide....

Has anyone installed these exhaust components in their own garage without a lift??

I would like to install a X-Pipe also... Is this installation difficult ??

I also would like to install a set of headers, but it appears these are well over a $1000 dollars for a corvette so these may have to wait. I can only imagine that these would be a pain in the XXX; as I have installed these on old vehicles and even with the extra space installation was difficult.

Any insight from the group that have installed some of the exhaust components themselves would be helpful...

Robert YellowVette · 06-08-05, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave123

Two of the performance upgrades I want for my vehicle is a cold air intake and exhaust upgrade.

I believe I will use a K&N cold air intake system for my vehicle as I like the look and I will not have to modify any stock components for the installation.

The exhaust I have been waiting for a good covette show in the Detroit area so I can hear some of the choices 1st hand.

Right now I am leaning towards a Borla Stinger system as it eliminates the mufflers but am concerned if the vehicle will be too loud and have the right sound I am looking for....

Maybe someone can let me know your thoughts on what sounds best...

Last I would like to install this myself. Can the stock exhaust be taken off and a new exhaust be put on without a lift just using a standard car jack. I can imagine you have to manuever the new and old exhaust out which may require the vehicle to be raised higher than what a normat jack will provide....

Has anyone installed these exhaust components in their own garage without a lift??

I would like to install a X-Pipe also... Is this installation difficult ??

I also would like to install a set of headers, but it appears these are well over a $1000 dollars for a corvette so these may have to wait. I can only imagine that these would be a pain in the XXX; as I have installed these on old vehicles and even with the extra space installation was difficult.

Any insight from the group that have installed some of the exhaust components themselves would be helpful...

If you are only installing an overpriced air cleaner for looks, go right ahead but don't fool yourself it will increase your hp by any measurable amount. How much time do you spend looking under your car's hood, as opposed to actually driving? I have a satin Vortech V-2 installed and while it sure do look purty, after 25,000 miles I now know what it looks like and only open the hood to service the engine or show off the blower to others...

Unless you are really unhappy with the sound of the Ti cat-backs the car comes with, there isn't much reason to change them. They are very light [lighter than any aftermarket brand] and have 30% less restriction than the base C5. Just like with fancy air cleaners, you are unlikely to get more power, just a lot more noise...

To test the sound of potential exhausts, I strongly advise you to find a Corvette club or meet where lots of modded cars will be and see if you can get a ride in some of them to hear what the cabin noise levels will be. All the aftermarket systems have more or less resonance at cruise, MOST far more than the stock Ti catbacks.

Just standing behind a static Z06 while someone hits the loud pedal does not tell you the whole story. It may indeed sound cool BACK there, but I have a set of B&B Bullet 2-tips for sale if you like LOUD... =;-]

Installing an x-pipe will require a tubing cutter that can cut 2.5" pipe or a 32-tooth hacksaw and a lift will make it a lot easier.

You will need a lift to change out your cat-backs, or some way to get the car at least 36" safely off the ground, more will help a lot.

An x-pipe will make stock Ti cat-backs a lot quieter, which is perfect for me because I like to street race now and then, but I am sure that is not why most people want one. When you can hear a C5 for 3 blocks before you can see him, so can DA MAN... =;-]

An x-pipe is useful for reducing the 'burbling and popping' on deceleration, once again take any claims about more hp with a large grain of salt.

Unless you have major H/C engine mods or a blower that you want to tweak for lots of hp, headers aren't worth the money for a mostly stock engine/car.

Keep your Ti cat-backs, you can sell them to base c5 people or put them back when you sell the car. And don't cut them to take them off, welding Ti is very difficult and expensive.

Dave123 · 06-09-05, 07:54 AM

Robert,

Thanks for the reply.

I don't disagree about the horsepower gains advertised for cold air or exhaust enhancements.

I have been debating on whether to do any modifications at all to my stock Z06. Afterall, if I planned on making modifications I would have been better off buying a used or new hard top/coupe and with the money saved.....add performance modifications to surprise the unknowing Z06 at a stop light.

I may add just a K&N filter replacing the stock paper element as this may improve breathing and will be re-usable. The cold air systems I have been interested in were being considered with aestetics in mind as well....Like you said I don't know if their worth the $$$ given the small performance gain and the fact you only see them with the hood open....

I have been thinking about the exhaust as the stock ZO6 at idle is to quiet and I would like to improve the sound. At full throttle the stock Z06 system sounds pretty good...no complaints there....

If I need a lift to do the job that may change my mind as by the time I pay a mechanic to change a cats back system + X-Pipe I will be looking at $1500-$2000. Given the small HP increase I don't know if this makes sense to obtain the improved idle sound I'm looking for...

Anyway thanks for the input...

06-09-05, 08:25 AM

With the back tires on ramps, you can easily change out your exhaust/mufflers from the over-the-axle piece back. I felt however that there wasn't enough room to get under there with ramps alone to install the x-pipe. I would definately want a lift to install the headers.

Mike

Heavy Duty · 06-09-05, 10:22 AM

Dave, what Robert is telling you is the truth. I too had considered doing those very things you mentioned. However, the price Vs HP gains just didn't figure in as being a smart move on my part. Yes the stock Ti exhaust is quite at idle and when you are just cruzing. I like that because I can take the wifey out to dinner in it and have a decent converstion while driving. The ricers think the car sounds whimmpy at the stop lights

. But when we go they get one hell-of-a suprise

. I do love having the best of both worlds. Loud when you want it, quite when you need it.

I looked hard at the cold air systems. Read everything i could get my hands on. everything I've read says that they offer no benefits until you reach about 60MPH. That is when they start to do their thing. If you want something that wakes up right off the line I would spend the money on a good blower which will add some serious HP.

I'll keep mine the way it is for now. I love rice cakes.

H.D.

Dave123 · 06-09-05, 02:13 PM

H.D.

I agree and am coming to the same conclusion.

I did make one change that was easy and enjoyable. This was a short throw shifter. It makes driving a hole lot more fun....

DAVE

DRTH VTR · 06-09-05, 02:28 PM

I would disagree a little with Heavy Duty. I have a VaraRam and I picked up about 0.3 seconds and 3-4 MPH in the 1/4 mile. There are people who whould also support the Blackwing and other intakes. I saw a comparison of a Blackwing, the VaraRam, and another intake, and the VaraRam was the winner on a stationary dynamometer. There was no ram effect on that test. The drawback is the possibility of taking in water, rather than air.

Will that make a "seat of the pants" change in performance? No. The suggestions of a head and cam swap or a supercharger would, but not the airbox and exhaust.
Just my $0.02

Heavy Duty · 06-09-05, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRTH VTR

I would disagree a little with Heavy Duty. I have a VaraRam and I picked up about 0.3 seconds and 3-4 MPH in the 1/4 mile. There are people who whould also support the Blackwing and other intakes. I saw a comparison of a Blackwing, the VaraRam, and another intake, and the VaraRam was the winner on a stationary dynamometer. There was no ram effect on that test. The drawback is the possibility of taking in water, rather than air.

Will that make a "seat of the pants" change in performance? No. The suggestions of a head and cam swap or a supercharger would, but not the airbox and exhaust.
Just my $0.02

DRTH..I have read that the intakes do add some HP resulting in a quicker time and MPH. But according to the articles that extra HP really didn't come on until the cars hit ~60MPH. Thus ram effect. I haven't read anything as to there effect on a stationary dyno. So i will say that I am ignorant in that area. Can you point me to the article that did that comparison? Do you have any time slips before and after you did yours? I'd like to see if those articles are telling the truth.

I still say the best bang for the buck is the supercharger. I've read ALOT of articles that show how much HP gains you can expect with different boost settings. Very impressive.

I did some calculations once and I came up that if you do JUSt the cold air intake and say some Borla stingers, if you spend say $2100 for both and net say an extra 25 horses, that comes out to about $84.00/horse. If you do just a supercharger for the same cost and it nets say an extra 55-65 horses, that comes to $38 to $32/horse. Am I off on this? I did run those figures by a friend of mine who builds and mods engines and he said that they were very close to being true. What do-y-a think?

H.D.

DRTH VTR · 06-09-05, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heavy Duty

DRTH..I have read that the intakes do add some HP resulting in a quicker time and MPH. But according to the articles that extra HP really didn't come on until the cars hit ~60MPH. Thus ram effect. I haven't read anything as to there effect on a stationary dyno. So i will say that I am ignorant in that area. Can you point me to the article that did that comparison? Do you have any time slips before and after you did yours? I'd like to see if those articles are telling the truth.

I still say the best bang for the buck is the supercharger. I've read ALOT of articles that show how much HP gains you can expect with different boost settings. Very impressive.

I did some calculations once and I came up that if you do JUSt the cold air intake and say some Borla stingers, if you spend say $2100 for both and net say an extra 25 horses, that comes out to about $84.00/horse. If you do just a supercharger for the same cost and it nets say an extra 55-65 horses, that comes to $38 to $32/horse. Am I off on this? I did run those figures by a friend of mine who builds and mods engines and he said that they were very close to being true. What do-y-a think?

H.D.

I think that you are absolutely correct about the dollars per horsepower. On a cost per horse, the cheapest is probably nitrous oxide. The supercharger has the advantage of being available all the time. I just don't have $8-10,000 to have one put on.

I will look for the article, but I cannot promise that I can find it. I have 4 years of four different Corvette magazines.

I have the time slips, but I also added drag radials shortly after. I will look to see if I made notes about what changes I made in what order. I may have done so, as I am a bit anal!

Robert YellowVette · 06-09-05, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave123

I may add just a K&N filter replacing the stock paper element as this may improve breathing and will be re-usable. The cold air systems I have been interested in were being considered with aestetics in mind as well....Like you said I don't know if their worth the $$$ given the small performance gain and the fact you only see them with the hood open...

Before you buy that K&N see:

http://home.usadatanet.net/~jbplock/ISO5011/SPICER.htm

Heavy Duty · 06-09-05, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DRTH VTR

I think that you are absolutely correct about the dollars per horsepower. On a cost per horse, the cheapest is probably nitrous oxide. The supercharger has the advantage of being available all the time. I just don't have $8-10,000 to have one put on.

I will look for the article, but I cannot promise that I can find it. I have 4 years of four different Corvette magazines.

I have the time slips, but I also added drag radials shortly after. I will look to see if I made notes about what changes I made in what order. I may have done so, as I am a bit anal!

No problem and i'll take your word for it since I have no personal experiance with modding these cars. Speaking of NO2. Is that a safe way to go with these cars?. I was talking to a gut this evening at a car show who makes his own set up (Dyno Tune) and he said that doing a 100 shot is no problem with these cars. He said that for about $700 he could put the kit in and set it up for me. What do you think? He has his own Z-06 and he has it setup for a 150 shot. But he retuned the computer so it woud retard the timeing when he hits the NO2 swirch.

H.D.

Robert YellowVette · 06-09-05, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heavy Duty

No problem and i'll take your word for it since I have no personal experiance with modding these cars. Speaking of NO2. Is that a safe way to go with these cars?. I was talking to a guy this evening at a car show who makes his own set up (Dyno Tune) and he said that doing a 100 shot is no problem with these cars. He said that for about $700 he could put the kit in and set it up for me. What do you think? He has his own Z-06 and he has it setup for a 150 shot. But he retuned the computer so it woud retard the timeing when he hits the NO2 switch.

DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!

As with any contractor, ask for references to previous customers and ask him how he does the tuning and what program he uses. It may not mean much to you but if he starts tap-dancing around those questions, run away fast... =;-]

Search the Internet for N02 + ls6 and see what is out there.

Find a trusted Corvette speed shop [Ask at your local Corvette club.] and see what they think about N02 in general and his offer specifically.

Your fastest Corvette mod is the supercharger, but you are looking at $8,000-$10,000 for 120 to 150 additional hp on a stock engine...

There is no such thing as a free brunch.

Heavy Duty · 06-10-05, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert YellowVette

DANGER, WILL ROBINSON!

As with any contractor, ask for references to previous customers and ask him how he does the tuning and what program he uses. It may not mean much to you but if he starts tap-dancing around those questions, run away fast... =;-]

Search the Internet for N02 + ls6 and see what is out there.

Find a trusted Corvette speed shop [Ask at your local Corvette club.] and see what they think about N02 in general and his offer specifically.

Your fastest Corvette mod is the supercharger, but you are looking at $8,000-$10,000 for 120 to 150 additional hp on a stock engine...

There is no such thing as a free brunch.

Thanks Robert. This guy had the system setup on his car ('03 Z-06). But that is ok. It is his car and if he messes up his car that is him. From what i have heard about NO2 you do have to be carefull with it. Even if you are only doing small shots. I also have heard the horror stories as well. I agree with you. i think if I was to do anything I would go the Supercharger route. But even with that you still have to be carefull with the boost pressures or risk taking the bottom end of an engine out.

Thanks again for the advice.

OBTW, Got me a Supercharged rustang last night. He got me on the jump, but once I hit 2nd gear I started pulling him back in. We talked afterwards he has a really nice '98. But he was surprised. He couldn't believe I was pulling him in stock Z-06. He thought that he would just keep pulling away

. He did say that the stock exhaust of the vette sounded really good at WOT. I think he wants a vette.

H.D.