Beating a dead horse again.

**junkyardjohn** · 07-28-10, 09:53 AM

Horsepower TV show, a few weeks ago bought an over the counter corvette LS3 engine, changed only the exhaust manifolds to camaro manifolds dyno'd the engine and got 495 h.p. out of the other wise bone stock motor. ( no dry sump ). Question: Would the power of been the same or more if it were using a dry sump system?

**Tuna** · 07-28-10, 11:25 AM

I can't see a dry sump making any more horsepower than a regular oil pan on a dyno unless the 'windage' in the pan of the wet sump engine is churning up oil and causing resistance to the crank shaft rotation. Most modern performance have windage trays and other things in the pan to keep the oil in the bottom of the pan versus getting all around the crankshaft.

Now for racing purposes, the dry sump has advantages like getting the oil away from the crankshaft where it can cause loss of power it high "G" corners.

**SnakeOiler** · 08-22-10, 09:14 PM

Did they dyno it before the manifold change? I would hope so, for baseline reference. If so, what was the baseline?

**junkyardjohn** · 08-23-10, 12:56 PM

Horsepower T.V. didn't say anything about any baseline. They simply took an over the counter LS3 crate motor, used camaro exhaust manifolds, dyno'd the motor and came up with the said horsepower at the flywheel.

**VettinFan** · 08-23-10, 03:16 PM

WoW. It's hard to believe they could get that much extra HP out of a stock LS3, with just the Camaro exhaust add-on.

**catbert** · 08-23-10, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by VettinFan

WoW. It's hard to believe they could get that much extra HP out of a stock LS3, with just the Camaro exhaust add-on.

Right. If Chevy could get that kind of horsepower, they wouldn't be advertising 430. I didn't think the SAE horsepower regimen was 50 hp tougher than a simple dyno pull. Something isn't right.

**SnakeOiler** · 08-23-10, 08:37 PM

Accessories rob a lot of power. Look at the different ratings back when they switched to SAE.

I think the test would have been better if, say, they tested different stock exhaust manifolds on the LS3: truck vs. camaro vs vette

make it at least interesting.

**junkyardjohn** · 08-24-10, 01:05 PM

Back in the late 1960's and 1970 the crysler 426 hemi was factory rated at 425 horsepower when in reality it produced over 650 h.p. The chevy 454 ( LS-7) over the counter was factory rated at 465 H.P. again in reality it produced 600 +H.P. Don't forget the ford boss 429 motor ( the highest) under rated motor yet. The factory horsepower rating then were to fall under the insurance companies radar as far as rates. Today, who knows.

**korvettekarl** · 11-10-10, 01:01 PM

I don't know about the numbers, but I know there is definitely a difference between the LS7 and the LS3. My Z06 was A LOT faster and had A Lot more torque than the LS3 that is residing in my GS right now. I will be adding a supercharger as soon as I can get the $ without the little woman noticing. I probably should have gotten another Z06 when the 07 was wrecked but boy that GS sure was pretty and had everything the Z had except the ponies. Live and learn. Anybody want to buy a 57 Bel Air?

**Hib Halverson** · 11-10-10, 02:39 PM

Before you can address this issue you first need to know...

1) Was the test on Horsepower TV run to the same SAE standard as is the stock engine, ie: in SAE test configuration which is, basically, the engine as run in the car--with cats and a full exhaust and the production ECM cal?

2) Was the dyno correction data SAE net?

3) Was it the same kind of dyno that GM uses to certify it's engines?

**Hib Halverson** · 11-10-10, 02:50 PM

Originally Posted by junkyardjohn

Back in the late 1960's and 1970 the crysler 426 hemi was factory rated at 425 horsepower when in reality it produced over 650 h.p. The chevy 454 ( LS-7) over the counter was factory rated at 465 H.P. again in reality it produced 600 +H.P. Don't forget the ford boss 429 motor ( the highest) under rated motor yet. The factory horsepower rating then were to fall under the insurance companies radar as far as rates. Today, who knows.

It is true that some muscle car era engines were underrated but the idea that the Street Hemi made 650 hp and the LS7, sold by GM Parts in the 70s and early 80s, made 600 is fantasy.

A production L88, with headers, tuned for racing and running racing gasoline produced 620-hp at 6800 rpm.

There is no way the Street Hemi or the LS7---at least in the form they were sold in cars or in crates, then installed in cars---made 650 and 600-hp respectively.

Now, the "Race Hemi"...the one supplied to drag racers like Sox&Martin, Ramchargers, etc and the NASCAR Grand National teams, may have been close to 650, but used parts not sold by Chrysler on the 425-hp Street Hemi.

An LS7, with headers, tuned for racing and on racing gasoline could have produced 600-hp.

In both cases, the engines were hardly streetable.

**johnnyclassic** · 11-26-10, 01:35 PM

I did a little investigating on what you wrote and by running it past what I consider the most knowledgeable guy on the subject he says your correct. His name is Don "big daddy" Garlits.

**junkyardjohn** · 11-26-10, 04:05 PM

Originally Posted by johnnyclassic

I did a little investigating on what you wrote and by running it past what I consider the most knowledgeable guy on the subject he says your correct. His name is Don "big daddy" Garlits.

Hi, I'am glad that I'am your first post. Yes I, we all heard of Big Daddy Don Garlits. also I also own a Blue grand sport rag top.

**johnnyclassic** · 11-27-10, 10:25 AM

Junkyardjohn, wow same type of vette, same town, same name I guess, what else? How bout a picture? Mine will comming soon.

**Schrade** · 12-10-10, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by johnnyclassic

Junkyardjohn, wow same type of vette, same town, same name I guess, what else? How bout a picture? Mine will comming soon.

Me too - I have a 2010 GS vette ragtop, and I'm gettin' a 2011 GS coupe for Christmas.

In fact, I think everybody has a 2010 GS on this forum board... Right?